Intervals in the Sets & Reps Editor

This is a hard workout, at least for me it would be.  It’s also a very long list of intervals.  Compare below: On the right is our standard editor and on the left is the new one.  Hello sets and reps 🙂  brought to you by the ERGdb team. The workout is brought to you by an author Flyf.  You can click here and see a lot of great workouts by him.

Here is a link to to this workout:  https://app.ergdb.org/workouts/fitness-3-vo2-intermittent-4

New Sets and Reps editor

The very loved standard edit mode

Just scroll down, down and down, and down…  keep going.  Hard to believe this is the same workout as on the left (above on mobile)

25 thoughts on “Intervals in the Sets & Reps Editor”

  1. Hi Alex,

    Some software to make FTP Test change from ERG to Sloope automatic, because are parts that wee need to make in ERG mode, but the test no, for best result is made in sloope mode.
    My question, with your creator is this possible? I think that with Zwift creator (http://zwofactory.com) is possible.

    Regards

  2. Hello Samoramobile, in reading this post on GoldenCheetah github

    https://github.com/GoldenCheetah/GoldenCheetah/issues/2220

    these guys make it sound like “FreeRide” is the same as slope mode. I know FreeRide does not control the power so I guess that is the same thing as needed in an FTP test like this. We don’t currently have a way to do it. You could manually edit the file after you download it. I will add this to my list of things to do as it would be very easy to add now that we have this new editor.

  3. Hi Alex,

    Today I try to change a Workout, but not work.

    Workout:

    Winter Cycling with Power Training Plan W3 Day 15 – ergdb
    FTP TEST Day 15

    Time: 45:00m ->

    Warm-Up – 10′ @ 70%
    5 X 30″ @ 100% with 30″ @ 70% rest
    5′ @ 75%
    20′ @ 110%
    Cooldown – 5′ @ 65%
    bike

    As you can check I change the second last level “” this is the 20″ FTP Test, but with this mod, I don´t have any resistance.

  4. jonathancolledge

    I don’t understand either, can you do an Ftp test in slope mode?

    You can make a workout using Ipbike on Android that has slope x% for y time, or x% for z distance as a workout step. You can use this for simulating hills. Alternatively, you can ride a gpx file on Golden Cheetah.

    I would like to see a workout step on ergdb/trainerday that could be grade with a target distance, but it’s a bit out of the Erg or mrc format right now and maybe I’m the only one!

    1. I missed your comment here Jonathan. When he says slope-mode I believe he means “manual resistance” mode where you have to shift yourself or in Zwift it is called free-ride. Different platforms call it slope-mode for some reason. So as I am sure you are aware most of the traditional FTP tests use “slope-mode.” I do know runners that want to enter things in distance and I also know coaches that use distance for simplicity at times. We could allow entering in distance but then converting it to time for MRC and ERG (based on w/kg and basic settings). ZWO, Garmin and TraininingPeaks all support distance targets I believe. We will likely support runners at some point so we should be able to include this at that time. I am not sure how grade would factor in because you can go very easy uphill or very hard.

  5. jonathancolledge

    Yes, so when I’m free riding in Zwift without grade control, the slope is set at the trainer’s default. To increase difficulty, you need to increase speed (cadence) or change up a gear whilst remaining at the same cadence.

    I can manually increase the slope that the trainer is set at (e.g. Using the Wahoo app, or with Ipbike). This equates to an increase in the simulated grade. This is why it is called slope mode.

    This is the bit that the Erg format doesn’t cater for – varying the slope of slope mode to simulate different slopes/grades.

  6. jonathancolledge

    See above, but also, in terms of FTP test in slope mode, if you are not in Erg mode, the slope will not change. If you are in Erg mode, the slope will change according to your gearing, so there isn’t a point where your FTP test Erg file or equivalent can specify the slope (it is theoretically possible, but I can’t quite see it working).

    1. Have you done a test in TrainerRoad? I think Zwift is the same that it is ERG mode right until the test then it automatically switches to manual/slope mode. This is not a ramp test but the 8-minute or 20-minute test with consistent maintained power for X minutes. So I don’t think slope means “slope” 🙂 in this case, but you are probably right as to why it is called that.

    2. Jonathan yes, I did some reading you are right on why it is called slope mode. Seems Computrainer started that. I guess these days when people say slope mode they mean “dumb trainer” mode which I believe is essentially the same thing. Not positive it makes that big of a difference that it simulates a slope other than getting the gearing right as you say. I am not that advanced of rider that I care about gearing on an indoor bike (other than the quietest gearing) but I guess some people are or might be 🙂

  7. Yeah, but your trainer is set to a “slope” when Erg mode stops and this isn’t specified by Zwift, but is specified by the trainer default. The Wahoo Kickr for example defaults to level 2 or 3 power curve, which is the equivalent to a slope (it isn’t actually, since this may be switched across levels in true slope mode according to speed, but I don’t know Wahoo’s exact protocol for slope simulation and it may not be consistent across other brands of trainers).

    1. Agreed. Slope mode is more of the designation of the increment rather than the mode itself other than possibly gearing estimation. I got my learning in for the day 🙂

  8. Hi,
    The problem is that I try all the way to make a workout file in your workout editor to run a FTP test, and I try all the possibilities that I found, and none off then work, so I don´t see how to creat this sprecific workout in your editor.

    1. Yes, you are correct Samoramobile it is not currently possible to create a slope mode workout/interval in TrainerDay. I have a formula to estimate FTP based on a ramp test if you need it. Ramp tests are ERG only and seem to be reasonably accurate and much easier than 20-minute or 8-minute FTP tests.

        1. Sure, my ramp test comes from a pro-cycling coach with 30-years experience 🙂 he has a laboratory and compares to measured LT. He says it is pretty accurate in his tests. I am a low FTP guy and it seemed to come out the same as SMO2 (muscle oxygen) testing but actually came out about 10 watts higher than TrainerRoad ramp test. The TR ramp test always seemed to be about the same as traditional so I don’t do traditional anymore.

          Here is the calculation.

          Do 15′ @ 40% of FTP. Then 2′ @ 0% (full rest). Then increase 25w every 1 minute. Take your last interval (25w/60 * last_interval_seconds) + previous_interval_watts. Take this value and multiply by 70% and 75% and that is the range of your FTP.

          So if you did 18 seconds of last interval of 275w. It would be 25/60*18 = 7.5w+250w = 283W*.7 = ~180-190w.

          1. Hi Alex,

            This Saturday I have a race “Classic Tróia-Sagres” 200kms, next week I will make this test and compare with others that I make, and tell you my opinion.

            Regards

  9. Hi Alex,

    is it possible to change te colums % FTP start and % FTP end in HR Start and HR end (Heartrate).
    If so peolple like me, who don’t have a powermeter, can also use the workouts.
    Or Does anyone know how the TXT-file formats looks to use with Heartate parameters? Or better is there a place where I can download HR workouts for use with WAhoo Roam?

    1. Hello DeMegens, sorry for the slow response I missed this. I plan to build this feature but it does not currently exist anywhere that I know of. Wahoo uses .plan files. You can find via google search how to create them, but this process would be a little painful. Really HR based training must be long intervals. Your HR takes about a minute to catch up with your effort so really probably 5-minute intervals are the shortest. This means really you probably only have 3-basic workouts that make sense. Recovery (Zone 1), Endurance Z1 warm-up and cool down with Z2 main work. And final is sweetspot or threshold workouts. Your sweetspot/threshold requires finding the maximum HR you have done for 40 to 60 minutes and target that HR for about 5-minute or longer intervals. Really this should be right below the place where your legs start to feel a little burning sensation (lactate threshold). I will create a good blog post on this early next year.

  10. Hello Alex,

    I have just designed a workout with a few sprints in between. I encounter two problems. On the one hand, the 6 seconds sprints (233 % FTP) are not shown in the curve of the workout, but the curve always remains below the FTP for the 73% of the FTP that I complete in the minutes before. On the other hand, when planning workouts with sets and reps, I would prefer two more columns to fill out. Namely not only the two columns with the rest time and rest FTP, but also a column where I enter the time after the rest time, how long it will take until the next interval starts. The same for FTP.

    So if I do a 6 second sprint, then have 24 seconds of recovery and then 9:30 minutes want to drive again in the endurance area as before the sprint, then I would like to do this in the workout planning under one interval in one line. And if I then want to drive three such blocks, I put a 3 in the repetitions.

    Or am I making a mistake? I always plan my intervals so that after the interval I have maybe 30 seconds to 2 minutes of recovery with maybe 50% of the FTP, but then drive again in the endurance area for 2 to 15 minutes (or longer). I see that as belonging to the interval and do not want to have to enter it separately each time. On the other hand, I don’t want to drive a 10-minute recovery between two intervals. Or do I drive the 10 minutes in the endurance area and let the 24 second recovery at 50% of the FTP out of the interval planning?

    Best regards
    Holger

    1. Hello Holger, you are right if you create workouts >= 60 minutes with 6-second sprints they are not shown, this might not be easy to fix but I do believe it is important so we will try to get to it ASAP. I understand what you want for the extra columns but think the best solution is to use the non-sets and reps for this. You can work very quickly using copy/paste. I don’t really want to modify the editor for special case workouts especially when it can fairly easily be accomplished another way. I will keep thinking about this and see if any ideas come to mind. I personally feel that after a high watt interval the period between it is a rest, even if that rest has multiple intensities, but really that depends on interpretation or workout/interval goals and stress. Not sure if that helps, but we should be able to fix the 6-second issue.

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